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	<title>Comments on: Is disk Everything for MySQL Performance ?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/</link>
	<description>Everything about MySQL Performance</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 04:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1</generator>
		<item>
		<title>By: peter</title>
		<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288824</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Apr 2008 03:48:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288824</guid>
		<description>Matt,

If you think about it in logical terms - disk based databases are about IO, and a lot of access patterns require random IO which is something disks are quite slow with.    You can tackle this problem by faster IO subsystem, larger cache sizes or both. 

It is indeed often amount of IO required is the problem for large applications. If you have faster IO subsystem you can have your application performing with smaller amount of cache memory, which is expensive and power consuming.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Matt,</p>
<p>If you think about it in logical terms - disk based databases are about IO, and a lot of access patterns require random IO which is something disks are quite slow with.    You can tackle this problem by faster IO subsystem, larger cache sizes or both. </p>
<p>It is indeed often amount of IO required is the problem for large applications. If you have faster IO subsystem you can have your application performing with smaller amount of cache memory, which is expensive and power consuming.</p>
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		<title>By: Ries van Twisk</title>
		<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288057</link>
		<dc:creator>Ries van Twisk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 16:58:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288057</guid>
		<description>@Matt,

in my case with IO I mean the channel to HD... Random IO is indeed a hard problem to tackle... There are some nice disk controllers with a heap of memory that can hanlde random IO better then disk controllers with less IO. Just pick a disk controller with a little battery so it can cope with power faults (Disk writes will continue from on-board memory as soon as power comes back up).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Matt,</p>
<p>in my case with IO I mean the channel to HD&#8230; Random IO is indeed a hard problem to tackle&#8230; There are some nice disk controllers with a heap of memory that can hanlde random IO better then disk controllers with less IO. Just pick a disk controller with a little battery so it can cope with power faults (Disk writes will continue from on-board memory as soon as power comes back up).</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Matt yonkovit</title>
		<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288045</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt yonkovit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 16:41:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288045</guid>
		<description>I followed up a bit on my blog about this.  It is a worthwhile discussion to have.  At the UC I don't remember who on the panel during the scale out/up keynote said it ( it was not you tube, I think it was one of the photo sites ) said that they were constantly battling with random IO.  IO does not always mean disk either...  Anyones thanks for comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I followed up a bit on my blog about this.  It is a worthwhile discussion to have.  At the UC I don&#8217;t remember who on the panel during the scale out/up keynote said it ( it was not you tube, I think it was one of the photo sites ) said that they were constantly battling with random IO.  IO does not always mean disk either&#8230;  Anyones thanks for comments.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: peter</title>
		<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288038</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 16:25:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288038</guid>
		<description>Ries,

Sure for READs  you can well relay on cache memory, though there is also the catch of warmup time which will heavily depend on your disk sysbsytem performance.
For writes (especially with Innodb)  large cache sizes also dramatically improve performance.  As soon as you can have logging load you just pretty much need your IO capacity to be large enough to handle background flushes from buffer pool during checkpoint - number of physical reads which need to be done decreases dramatically if you have a lot of memory but surely can't be eliminated completely.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ries,</p>
<p>Sure for READs  you can well relay on cache memory, though there is also the catch of warmup time which will heavily depend on your disk sysbsytem performance.<br />
For writes (especially with Innodb)  large cache sizes also dramatically improve performance.  As soon as you can have logging load you just pretty much need your IO capacity to be large enough to handle background flushes from buffer pool during checkpoint - number of physical reads which need to be done decreases dramatically if you have a lot of memory but surely can&#8217;t be eliminated completely.</p>
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		<title>By: peter</title>
		<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288018</link>
		<dc:creator>peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 16:00:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-288018</guid>
		<description>Daniel, 

Right Financial and other installations is where storing binary logs on separate volume makes sense. For others  having say nightly backup w multiple generations, more regular backup of binary logs + slave can offer decent recovery capabilities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daniel, </p>
<p>Right Financial and other installations is where storing binary logs on separate volume makes sense. For others  having say nightly backup w multiple generations, more regular backup of binary logs + slave can offer decent recovery capabilities.</p>
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		<title>By: Ries van Twisk</title>
		<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-287926</link>
		<dc:creator>Ries van Twisk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 12:41:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-287926</guid>
		<description>Any user needs to take a look at what he does with his database, if you do mostly reads on your database, then for sure having 64GB of memory will help you a lot during your queries, sorting and doing joins...

However if you are doing a lot of write to your database then IO performance is everything in the end of the transaction you want your data to be save on your HD, not floating around in memory.

The article above needs to clarify about what is needed under what condition...

Ries</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any user needs to take a look at what he does with his database, if you do mostly reads on your database, then for sure having 64GB of memory will help you a lot during your queries, sorting and doing joins&#8230;</p>
<p>However if you are doing a lot of write to your database then IO performance is everything in the end of the transaction you want your data to be save on your HD, not floating around in memory.</p>
<p>The article above needs to clarify about what is needed under what condition&#8230;</p>
<p>Ries</p>
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		<title>By: daniel</title>
		<link>http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-287812</link>
		<dc:creator>daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 09:43:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2008/04/25/is-disk-everything-for-mysql-performance/#comment-287812</guid>
		<description>&#62; If you dedicate RAID1 volume for Operating system and another one for Transactional Logs you will often wast 4 hard drives from performance standpoint without a good reason.
&#62; I tend to keep Innodb data files (and whole datadir) and log files on the same partition as well because this makes it very easy to use LVM for backups while assuming you have BBU on the raid volume impact on transactional log write speed is usually minimal. 

I definitely support these statements from testing and experience.

This reminds me of a discussion with a virtualization vendor about IO rate limiting, of which the main point was that if you force specific IO requests to be reordered based on userspace priorities, you prevent the kernel (and bbwc units) from properly serializing IOs based on physical disk layout and end up with a large net reduction in disk performance. I believe a fairly similar case is also true when data/logs are physically separated (artificially "rate limiting" -- may be imagined as "protecting" -- io by splitting data/logs) and disk writes are not allowed to be globally managed; you'll end up losing a lot of IO performance unnecessarily.

Only in sensitive situations where periodic backups would not be sufficient for recovery (financial etc.) would separate partitioning be necessary, as you mentioned.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt; If you dedicate RAID1 volume for Operating system and another one for Transactional Logs you will often wast 4 hard drives from performance standpoint without a good reason.<br />
&gt; I tend to keep Innodb data files (and whole datadir) and log files on the same partition as well because this makes it very easy to use LVM for backups while assuming you have BBU on the raid volume impact on transactional log write speed is usually minimal. </p>
<p>I definitely support these statements from testing and experience.</p>
<p>This reminds me of a discussion with a virtualization vendor about IO rate limiting, of which the main point was that if you force specific IO requests to be reordered based on userspace priorities, you prevent the kernel (and bbwc units) from properly serializing IOs based on physical disk layout and end up with a large net reduction in disk performance. I believe a fairly similar case is also true when data/logs are physically separated (artificially &#8220;rate limiting&#8221; &#8212; may be imagined as &#8220;protecting&#8221; &#8212; io by splitting data/logs) and disk writes are not allowed to be globally managed; you&#8217;ll end up losing a lot of IO performance unnecessarily.</p>
<p>Only in sensitive situations where periodic backups would not be sufficient for recovery (financial etc.) would separate partitioning be necessary, as you mentioned.</p>
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